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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Dilemma /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1157904367 Message started by TVRacer on 09/10/06 at 09:06:07 |
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Title: Dilemma Post by TVRacer on 09/10/06 at 09:06:07 My brother has a Ducati Monster 620 and I would like to get a Savage/S40 (yes, still looking). My other choices are an older Buell Cyclone or a Ninja 250. I will mostly go riding with my brother. He likes the twisties and I am concerned about being able to keep up with him on a Savage/S40. I already kart race, so have little interest in "racing" on the road. Have any of you ridden your Savage/S40 on the twisties with a friend who has a sportbike? Is there any compatability or will we just have to agree to meet somewhere down the road? Tom |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by RadarORiley on 09/10/06 at 10:38:55 I haven't ridden with a sport bike but do occasionally have as company, riders on Big Harleys, choppers and other larger bikes. I don't have any problem keeping up, in fact I am often in the lead. The Savage is quite nimble, & does a great job on twisties. That's my favorite ride. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by Reelthing on 09/10/06 at 10:43:31 Hard question - no idea how your buddy rides that Ducati - the savage runs well (better with some help - jets&exhaust,etc) and handles ok (pretty well with some help - shocks,tires,fork brace,etc) but in the right hands the Ducati will run off and leave any cruiser ever made in the curves. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by Paladin on 09/10/06 at 15:16:57 I took Thumper on the Angeles Crest a while back. Nobody passed me and I was nowhere near pushing the limits. No one was grossly breaking the speed limits. As Reelthing said, it depends on the rider more than the bike. For a cruiser the Savage handles very well, from what I've heard. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by PerrydaSavage on 09/10/06 at 15:19:19 My advice is ... Don't Race on public Roads ... |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by babbalou on 09/10/06 at 17:03:57 As cruisers go, the S40 is about as nimble as they get, mostly from the light weight. But, the rake & trail figures are 35 degrees/5.8" compared to a sportbike's typical 25/4-5" so on a tight winding road, if you're really pushing it, it takes a bit longer to lean it over back & forth & the front end feedback is a little benign in those conditions. But, turn it down a notch & it's in it's element. A few things make a big improvement; 12 1/2" shocks, fork brace, Metzler ME880 tires & 20W fork oil work wonders if you push it to its limits in the corners, especially bumpy ones. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by mornhm on 09/10/06 at 17:39:21 With the same rider skill level, any sport bike mildly exercised will leave the Savage (and probably any cruiser) far behind, twisties or not. But there are enough differences in rider skill level that the savage can keep up or excel in many cases. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by Steve530 on 09/10/06 at 19:16:05 My wife has a Ninja 250 and I have a Savage. (We're both beginners.) I have riden her Ninja several times. I think it's more of a standard bike than a sport bike, but it is more nimble and flickable than a Savage. The Savage is more torquey, and, with the mods, seems to have more power than a Ninja 250. Different bikes, both good in their own ways. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by TVRacer on 09/10/06 at 19:48:50 Thanks all... I really appreciate the feedback!!! I keep coming back to the Savage/S40, even though some months ago, I came this close to buying a Ninja 250. I took it out with the owner, who also had some type of a sit-up Yamaha. When we got to the furthest point on the test ride, I traded with him and felt soooo much more comfortable on the Yamaha. I need the sit-up-right position, so even if I did end up with a not-so-sporty sport bike, I would still have to change the handlebars. I really don't have the urge to go all out while riding, I just want to go for nice country rides. I guess I need to listen to what I am saying :) Getting my bike seems to be taking along time, but that's OK, I have a few other projects I need to finish first. One of these days, I hope I surprise you all with a Savage/S40 :) Hi Paladin! Since I live in N. California, can you tell me more about Angels Crest? Steve530, do you have any problems when you go for rides with your wife....dissimilarities in handling, keeping up with each other, not other problems ;) PS. I forgot to say, I also came this close to buying an '87 Savage a year ago or so. I even took the $ and my trailer to go pick it up, but it had wayyyy too much rust :( Tom |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by TVRacersbrother on 09/10/06 at 20:28:38 PerrydaSavage wrote:
Great advice. As big brother to TVRacer I wanted to clarify Tom's post. Having a Monster 620 and Tom thinking about a Savage I suggested he post to see what others' thoughts were on whether a Savage rider would feel either left behind or not enjoy the riding experience as much as possible when riding with a Monster ridden sportingly but NOT RACING ON PUBLIC STREETS. I like to ride fast but smooth; not use the brakes very much; and just have a good time making time a little above the speed limits on the slower posted twisty roads with few cars. If Tom gets a Savage and is pushing it to try to keep up with me then it won't be as much fun for him. I'm 62, a fairly good rider with 40,000 long ago street miles and intend to stay alive and keep the bike on its feet (don't we all think that!). Well, hopefully. Hi Bro. Steve Stephens |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by Paladin on 09/10/06 at 21:26:38 TVRacer wrote:
http://savage.andruschak.net/Twisties/ |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by PerrydaSavage on 09/11/06 at 02:16:15 Sorry fellows ... I really didn't mean to raise any hackles ... it's just that "trying to keep up" with more experienced Riders is a mistake that a lot of Newbies make ... have done it myself ... can lead to a heap big pile 'o hurt ... :( An aside ... was feeling pretty low when I made my earlier post, as I had just returned from our local Toys for Tots Charity Ride ... great weather, great turn out, but an old friend of mine, her sister and neice went down ... cut off by a cager yakking on a darn cell phone ... taken to hospital via ambulance ... no word yet on extent of injuries ... :( |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by mornhm on 09/11/06 at 05:24:37 TVRacersbrother - hello and welcome - You have the riding experience and know what you ride like. Test ride a Savage for your brother through an area like what you want to ride in the future riding in your normal style, time the ride, then take the Ducati and ride it like you normally would ride and time the ride. Big difference in times is going to probably lead to your brother pushing the Savage trying to keep up. If you are riding at a pace that allows the Savage to keep up, then the problem shouldn't exist. If you feel like you're still learning the Ducati and going faster each ride, the above suggestion isn't going to work. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by TVRacer on 09/11/06 at 10:06:00 Thanks Paladin! Perry, no worries, and I'm sorry to hear about the accident. mornhm, your post (great idea, BTW!) gave me an idea. They rent Harleys and while I don't want one, that will give me some idea about riding a Savage with my brother. When he says "I like to ride fast but smooth; not use the brakes very much", gee, why does that sound just like me when I am kart racing :D I have the feeling he may be riding closer to the edge than I agree with. But since he just took off on a 10 day trip, he is not here to defend himself....HA :) We get along great, so there's no worries on anything you may say to either of us. I'm not a newbie rider, I had many motorcycles for years, but that was also years ago, but have been riding a bit recently. Hey, I might just go ahead and get the Savage/S40 anyway and just tell my brother to shove it ;) He can just wait up for me! Tom |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by MacAttack on 09/12/06 at 11:01:33 I've put about 3000 miles on my wife's S40 this summer, commuting to work (this involves gravel, country road, and town streets). I've found the bike light, smooth, and comfortable to ride, and the only thing I don't think I would care for is 70mph freeway all day (60 works much better). I also ride a Honda XR650R - a desert racer - that's been made street-legal. Compared to the S40, the XR is much faster and better handling, but quite twitchy, due to the short wheelbase. I think the XR is one level up in handling, but it's not near as comfortable or fun to ride on the street. Wish I had a better comparison for you. If it were me, I'd probably be partial to the Buell, but I haven't been on one, so I wouldn't know for sure. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by TVRacer on 09/12/06 at 20:34:09 MacAttack, Great, that's what I have been looking for, comparisons, even if you are not talking about a sportbike. My big button is not top speed, just decent acceleration and upright seating position. I won't be doing much freeway riding. Tom |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by Reelthing on 09/12/06 at 21:10:03 well, how much you have to spend? |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by TVRacer on 09/12/06 at 21:17:13 Nothing now :) $6000 next year. Tom |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by Reelthing on 09/12/06 at 21:24:08 well hells bells that can put you on serious steed! |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by mornhm on 09/13/06 at 05:15:30 TVRacer wrote:
I get the impression you are looking at used MC's. For that kind of money you can get a very recent Kawasaki Concours (my latest MC) and keep up with pretty much any MC without effort. Plus you can carry your raingear and only purchase at every other gas stop ;) |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by TVRacer on 09/13/06 at 10:35:44 Well, as you can tell, I just haven't made up my mind as yet. Although, at this point, I am 90% for getting a Savage/S40. I would prefer not to spend the $6000, and even a new S40 is only $4399. Used Savage/S40, perhaps. I was just so dissapointed with the last used Savage I tried to buy. It just made me think, with a brand new bike, I wouldn't have to worry about replacing anything. I have seen the Kawasaki Concours before, and you are correct, that would fit both sportsbike/cruiser categories, however, it's wayyyyy too heavy. I will use my little kart trailer to also haul my bike long distances, and shouldn't go much over 425 lbs. Another thing great about the Suzuki, the weight! I cannot believe there aren't more comparisons out there with those who have ridden both a sportbike and the Savage/S40 in regards to handling? Tom |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by Reelthing on 09/13/06 at 12:36:11 The proper crotch rockets make my back, kidneys, and wrists ache after about an hour at most, as well as folding my heels up under my cheeks is just not very comfortable to me. But there's a wide margin in the way "sport bikes" are made - the bikes nearer to a "standard" with an upright position are quite reasonable to ride - so it must be 425lbs or less - that should narrow the field some. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by mornhm on 09/13/06 at 13:57:09 TVRacer wrote:
As you point out, the Concours is a bit piggy. However the advantage of a MC like that is you put the trailer away and just ride.:) Also all is forgiven once she starts moving ;D and most things forgotten once she gets above 7,000 rpm ;D ;D As far as getting lots of comparisons, most people that are on this forum don't have sport bikes, they have Savages, and a fair number have the Savage as their only MC. Also a sport bike is about as far removed from a Savage for comparison as you can get and not be pedalling and still have wheels on the ground. I know it doesn't help you a lot, but as I said before there really isn't much comparison, a sport bike is going to leave a cruiser especially a low powered cruiser in the rear view mirror. The sport/touring bikes that I have ridden are like they are on rails. They have way more ground clearance than a cruiser (Many times on the Savage just on normal riding, I found myself dragging the pegs around corners) and usually a much higher HP to weight ratio. As you get more into the sport end of things, the MC's become much easier to lean into turns. Finally Sport MC's (at least for some) are much more comfortable to ride. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by Reelthing on 09/13/06 at 14:46:16 mornhm wrote:
He77 to get old - better than not I guess :) |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by lancer on 09/13/06 at 15:05:03 Have you considered the Ninja 650 twin? I have not ridden one myself but by all reports it is an excellent all around bike. Light weight like the Savage, a good bit more power, good handling, about $5500, upright seating for a semi-sportbike/standard type bike, etc. I have read about 6 write-ups on it and all of them like it. Recently it was voted one of the best bikes of the year, but I cannot remember which pub did that. If I had to replace my Savage, and stay in this price range, this would be my choice. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by SavageDude on 09/13/06 at 19:15:37 Just add to the note when chossing your bike. The insurance on Savage is on the bottom end while the sport bike category is ??? (high end most likely). I agree with Lancer about the Ninja 650; I wish I have the mula to add that bike to my garage.JMO |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by babbalou on 09/13/06 at 19:51:35 I like that Ninja 650 too. Read everything I can find on it & lurked on their forum some. Probably suits my riding style better but more $$$. :P The U.K. website lists a thicker padded seat as a factory option. They should sell those in the U.S. You might find a used Ninja 650 for $5K or so. |
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Title: Re: Dilemma Post by TVRacer on 09/14/06 at 11:31:01 mornhm wrote:
Makes sense :) lancer wrote:
babbalou wrote:
Ohhhhh, yes!!!! I like the European naked version much better. I wish they had that over here. SavageDude wrote:
Interesting, good point! I hadn't even thought about that much, as my brother's Duc insurance is cheap!! Still 90-95% leaning towards Savage/S40 :) Tom |
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