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Message started by Trippah on 02/05/06 at 14:28:55

Title: white spacer help please
Post by Trippah on 02/05/06 at 14:28:55

hi- thought i'd try the white spacer mod- so, removed tak after removing seat. Drilled out the mixture plug alright, for future work. NOW, do I have to take the carb out/off or can I work in situ.. remove the the top of the carb while still on bike. Almost 60 and still dumb..but having fun :D. thanks for replies..and i did a search but didn't see anything about the simple step 1. Super bowll is almost here..but my patriots aren't.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Reelthing on 02/05/06 at 14:57:55

I did both the '95 and '02 with the carb on the bikes - you can loose up the hose clamps a little and twist the carb a bit if you need to.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Savage_Rob on 02/05/06 at 15:04:16

I was able to do everything on it with it in place... just with the seat and tank removed. Replacing the phillips screws with stainless allen screws will make that access easier later.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by mmosel on 02/05/06 at 17:23:03

Question - how do you know which stainless allen screws to buy?

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Reelthing on 02/05/06 at 19:34:48

m5x10mm for the cap and m5x15mm for the bowl - stainless allen head work real fine

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Steve530 on 02/05/06 at 20:13:24

I had the carb off because I needed to clean it and still stripped 3 of the four screws on top of the carb. I had to use needle-nose vice-grips to get them out. Those screws are very soft. So have replacements ready.

I think it would be easier for you to get to the screws if you remove it. After the tank is off, you just need to disconnect the throttle cable and the air boot. It's not really abig deal, IMHO.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by threezukes on 02/05/06 at 21:33:24

Taking it off is the easy part. For me it is always a real PITA to get that air boot back on.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by slavy on 02/06/06 at 08:02:44

Take off the seat, the gas tank, the decompressor controller /the black box just above the carb/, the left side cover, the chrome tool cover, and the battery box top cover. Disconnect the trottle cable. Loosen the 2 clamps that hold the carburetor tight. First thing unscrew the 4 top screws that hold the carb. top cover /use a really good philips screwdriver/. Do the spacer mod. Before You put the cover back , twist the carb about 45-60 degrees and do the rejetting. Finish with the bottom, twist the carb. back to normal, install the carb slider with the diaphragm, the spring and the top cover back.Tighten the 2 clamps, hook-up the trottle cable and from here on is just to install the body pieces. You are done !

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by lancer on 02/06/06 at 08:20:38

mmosel wrote:

Question - how do you know which stainless allen screws to buy?

Take one of each type of screw you want to replace to the hardware store, and tell the friendly helper that you want 4 of each size...but in allen head stainless steel.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Ed_L. on 02/06/06 at 11:57:43

If you strip out the allen heads on the screws and need to get on them with a pair of pliers take a small file and flatten the sides of the screw heads. That way you can get a better grip on the little s*ckers with the pliers. I rejetted and did the white spacer mod with the carb in place, just loosen it and rotate it, why take it apart any more than needed.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Savage_Rob on 02/06/06 at 12:13:19

That's one thing I always liked about allen heads, if they strip, you can usually get it out pretty easily with an EZ-Out without the need to drill.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Trippah on 02/06/06 at 19:13:49

Thanks all for your suggestions-slavy, I honestly don't think it would have crossed my mind to tilt the carb in place to work on it- gracias. Did stop in the local hardware glancing at the bolts/screws- the m5x15's didn't seem in stock, and actually they didn't call them allen heads either- a little more research with one of each of the screws in hand is called for. AH, so much to learn- fortunately in New England, Winters can be long :P

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Steve530 on 02/06/06 at 21:36:13

Hey Trippah,

Ace hardware around here have a set of small drawers with special hardware. That's where you need to look.

What is being suggested is that you replace the standard screws with allen cap head bolts. These usually have a round slightly knurled top with a hexagonal "socket" for an allen wrench. Pick an allen wrench to fit the bolt while you're there.

The bolts are 5 mm in diameter. I think they have a 0.8 mm thread pitch, which is standard for this size bolt. I used 12 mm long bolts for the top and 17mm long bolts for the bottom. Since the bolt threads through the flange, a little extra length is no problem. Just ask the guy for four M5x10mm or M5x12mm and four M5x15mm or M5x17mm allen cap head bolts. That should get you the right stuff.

Edited to correct bolt pitch, 0.8 mm is standard.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Savage_Rob on 02/07/06 at 06:01:23

Ditto. Ace Hardware.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Trippah on 02/07/06 at 16:17:22

Thanks- ace is the place , will stop by manana. Say, the screws didn't budge on first try- are they installed by Sumo wrestlers? I blasted them with liquid wrench, tomorrow morning will see if they are any more compliant. Reminds me of some first dates when I was a pup. :D

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Reelthing on 02/07/06 at 16:31:59

Take um to dinner!

Just takes solid pressure with a new phillips bit - when your at the ace look at the phillips bits - there are some with groves that hold pretty well - on the '02 I used the cordless dewalt

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by diesel on 02/07/06 at 21:34:08

for those extra tight phillips screws, try dipping screw driver tip in just a little valve grinding compound, really helps screw driver tip bite those screw heads.(find that tip in the manual)

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Savage_Rob on 02/08/06 at 08:04:46

Trippah wrote:

I did the old trick of putting the phillips screwdriver into the screw firmly and giving it a tap with a hammer. It seems to unfreeze bound threads sometimes. If I'd had the carb off the bike, I would have used the impact driver.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Ed_L. on 02/08/06 at 15:42:59

I just went in there with a screwdriver and stripped a couple heads, why do it the easy way when you can get all frustrated and throw tools all over the garage ;D.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Trippah on 02/08/06 at 16:30:12

well- so far it has been special, the wall mounted tv I installed actually stayed in place, my attempted switch from dial up to cable - nope, 2 tries at the screws, nope, the three window replacement i bought, too short and non refundable.. another day another flying tool. Like you, Ed_L, I do tend to project my frustration thru flying tools. :) May have to hang a dart board in the garage if this continues..tomorrow is another day. Have a great one everyone.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Trippah on 02/15/06 at 19:26:16

vise grips to the rescue..carb is apart. In replacing the white spacer, does it have to be a plastic spacer? For those of us (like me) who are toolistically challanged, how did you hold the spacer to grind it down?? Hopefully I'll have it all back together before i hit the big 60 later this month.
Thanks again to all who have helped.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by babbalou on 02/15/06 at 19:33:43

I pressed mine onto a piece of sandpaper with my fingertip & just scrubbed it around & measured it a few times. I liked it better than using the #4 washers, which tended to drag the sides some, though some don't have that problem.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Reelthing on 02/15/06 at 20:08:35

put the sand paper - about a 120 or so - on a board so you end up with flat white spacer and work it around with your finger tip - mic it as it starts to shrink - or if you use the washers, get a long machine screw/bolt and nut that the washers will fit on - washers on the bolt nut on next to hold them tight - bolt in the drill and turn them babies down against the concret floor or a brick or what ever till they fit and slide smooth in the carb.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Dynobob on 02/15/06 at 20:11:07

babbalou wrote:

I did exactly the same. Fine sandpaper and I measured a few times with a cheap micrometer. I prefer the original white spacer to metal washers too.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Trippah on 02/16/06 at 16:30:03

well, the spacer has lost @half its weight/bulk. Brought it to the hospital I work at, and was talking with the folks there, They suggested drilling a hole in block of hard wood, the depth I wanted to keep- then filing off the unwanted portion. I said, I don't have a drill press, they said-"we do..wait ten minutes.." The carb is now reassembled (Hopefully correctly- will test tomorrow.)
ThANKS FOR YOUR TIPS-as I had looked at using the grinding wheel but couldn't figure out how to get a flat surface or 2)how to hold so small an object. The idea of drilling a hole the depth I wanted of the same diameter- wouldn't have crossed my mind for heaven knows how long. Will keep it in my ever growing tips for mechanic's file ;D

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by Trippah on 02/21/06 at 16:28:58

hit 28 degrees far this weekend. Bike started with a little trouble, ran strong through half throtle, then no noticable change last half throttle to wide open..I suspect I din't reassemble the card correctly. :o
Can't wait for some warmer weather to get this sorted out. Have a great week folks.

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by dichotomous on 03/20/06 at 14:55:42

how shall I get those two white spacer screws out now that they are very much stripped? they are really deep in there, should I drill them out from the bottom? and what size are those so I can get some allen head replacements?

Title: Re: white spacer help please
Post by pgolden on 03/20/06 at 16:02:36

If you can't get them from the top, you must drill them out from the bottom. Be carefull with the needle jet, it really gets in the way while you are drilling. My drill chuck deformed my needle jet. I had to get a new one.