|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Changing Turnsignals /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1093209080 Message started by Munson_kl279 on 08/22/04 at 14:11:20 |
|
Title: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/22/04 at 14:11:20 I just removed the OEM turnsignals on my 1986 Savage and started wiring new "custom" ones and I've been stumped. I have everything wired and when I turn the signals on they just stay on and not blink. :'( I've tried everything I can think of. I'm hoping someone else had this problem and has been able to fix it. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Greg_650 on 08/23/04 at 02:11:35 What is the wattage on the new bulbs that you installed? |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/23/04 at 07:31:12 I'm not sure, there's nothing on the paperwork I received with them. I'll have to take the lights apart to find out. I wouldn't think that should have any affect though. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Greg_650 on 08/23/04 at 08:56:22 Front or back? |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/23/04 at 10:33:53 Both, I just spoke with someone else and now I think I understand. The bulbs I'm using are not high enough watts so it's like they are burnt out. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by gitarzan on 08/23/04 at 12:15:51 Low Wattage bulbs shouldn't make a diff, they'll just burn dimmer. I do believe. Now if you were plugging 6 volt bulbs in a 12 volt system that might make a diff. Are you sure it wired to the turnsignal circuit not the running lights? |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/23/04 at 12:26:36 Yep, I spent all day Saturday and Sunday trying different things with the same results. I used the original wires on the bike to hook the new lights to. The only way I could get them to work was is I hooked them in-line with the OEM lights. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Greg_650 on 08/23/04 at 13:39:22 Your front signals are 3 wire (w/ running lights) and the rear are just 2 wire. These are the correct lights, right? As for watts...in DC that is volts X current. Since the volts haven't changed, then if they are higher watt bulbs they require more current. I'm thinking that if the wattage on the bulbs are too high then you don't have enough current to operate the flasher relay and they stay on. If they are lower wattage they will blink faster than normal too....more power for the flasher. You'll notice that when one bulb is out too (half watts). Let me ask this....does your indicator plus both front and rear (on either side) stay on when this happens? |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/23/04 at 17:52:50 The new lights are single element. The OEM front one were the 3 wire with duel element and the rear ones were 2 wire single element. Yes the indicator light stays lite as well as the lights themselves. I've also spoken with my guy at the local auto shop and he told me that since the new lights are only 10 watts each and the OEM lights were 23 watts that the new ones are not pulling enough power to cause the blinker relay to work. I've tried finding new bulbs but due to the size of the new lights I have not been able to find ones that are the same size and have the higher watts. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Mr 650 on 08/23/04 at 23:33:29 Quote:
Most modern blinkers will quit if you burn out a bulb. This is a similar problem as the circuit only sees less than 1/2 the current it used to see w/ the 23W bulbs. So now it thinks one of them is burnt out. Hmmm, Mr.Ohm says E/IxR or W=ExI, so we need to pull the same current as the old bulbs to make the blinkers click. :-/ (Ya’ll please check my math, used to do this long ago) Try this on for size; Old bulbs were 23W= 12V x I or 23W/12V = 1.916666 Amps or just say they pull 2 amps. You now have only 10 W/12V or .8333333 amps/bulb. We need more amps. ??? 23W-10W =13W, we need 13 more watts to get back to where we were so, 13W/12V=1.08333333 or just say we need to pull about one more amp (per bulb). R=12v/1A or a 12 ohm resistor rated like 15 to 20 watts. Go with the higher wattage that will fit inside the housing. May be easier to find a more powerful 20 to 25 watt bulb that fits your new socket or add 1 more bulb for each housing than attempt to parallel a resistor across each socket. Therefore, if you cannot find a 20W to 25W bulb to fit in your existing socket, then you could use four resistors of approximately 12 ohms, rated 15 watts, or more, across each existing bulb or parallel a second 10W bulb in each housing. Check Radio Shack or local electronics supply house. Look at the parts to see if thay are small enough to fit inside the blinker housing. Then just parallel each resistor (or second 10W to 12W bulb) across each existing bulb. ;D It should work; 1st check to see if you can find bulbs that are rated 20 to 25 watts that will just plug in, if not I hope the new resistors or new bulbs will fit in your smaller blinker housings. Those little resistors that look like little ceramic bricks ought to do the job. My brand new '86-'03 Clymer manual just hit the mail slot. I will need to study it for a while; there is likely a better way. Seems like the High Plains Thumper worked on similar problems a couple of years ago only they were using the cool new LEDs too. Opps, that website is down. :-[ |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Greg_650 on 08/24/04 at 02:15:04 And what about the dimmer burning bulbs at 10 watts? Will they be as visible? The really bad part is that they can't be returned if they don't work right... |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/24/04 at 05:12:56 I found out that the best way to fix the problem is with a load equalizer. I was able to find them for $4.95 a piece. Supposedly I need one for each side. I went ahead and picked up 4 of them (in case I need one for each light or if I screw one up! ;)) I'll let you know if it works when they come in. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/27/04 at 07:19:31 Well, I ordered the Stage I equalizers from CustomLED.com and guess what...They didn't work!! ??? I even tried hooking four of the equalizers up to the same side of the bike and it didn't make a difference. I guess they just are not pulling enough juice to makeup the difference. I have an e-mail into the company to see if they have any suggestions, or I guess I will be returning them. I figure until I can get something worked out I can either manually flip the lights on and off or I can just use hand signals! :P |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Mr 650 on 08/27/04 at 10:03:34 What are these Eq's? How are they supposed to worK? In the mean time try those resistors across the new lights. they should only be about $1 ea. or less. ;) |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/27/04 at 11:24:53 The equalizers actually pull more watts to cause the signal to think the light bulb is bigger than it really is. I just found out the reason the equalizers that I bought didn't work was because they are only pulling an additional 2 watts each. I need to make up atleast a 26 watt difference per side. :o That's a big difference. The company I bought the Stage I equalizers from do sell ones that are supposedly 27 watt equallizers. I guess I'm going to have to try those. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Greg_650 on 08/28/04 at 04:30:15 Are you sure that the running lights on the front 2 signals are connected correctly? |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by suzyssuzi on 08/28/04 at 07:27:29 i just replaced my turn signals as well and they do not flash. please need more info on how to wire in resistor, can i just wire in one for front and one for rear or do i need 4, there is not much room in the signal housings. need help? thanks. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Greg_650 on 08/28/04 at 07:38:09 I don't know. A lot of work is going on with this problem, but honestly, it doesn't sound like the real cause of the problem has been found yet. I wouldn't be buying resistors until someone says that it works. BTW - when I took my last spill, I broke a rear turn signal. And not wanting to spend $60 plus bucks for one replacement, I spent $20 on a set of aftermarket ones. They worked fine. So I don't know what is going on. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Mr 650 on 08/28/04 at 13:29:59 Quote:
Same wattage as the originals? I looked @ the diagrams in my new manual and it shows good old fashioned relay. It will require "x" amount of current to operate the circuit. If the other/larger 'equalizers' don't work the circuit, you want to play safe, get a rheostat or potentiometer, Say 1K ohms and put that across the new light and then turn on the blinker for that side. It won't blink yet. Since you would set the pot., to it’s highest setting, it would pose no danger to the circuit as it would draw insignificant current w/ the setting on highest resistance (which you would check 1st). Then slowly turn the pot. up until it just activates the blinker. Leave it set, remove pot. from blinker circuit and read the resistance w/ your meter, and get a resistor of that resistance or slightly less resistance is OK, if you can't get the exact resistance you measured for each side, and install one for each side. You will only need one resistor for each side, so install each one frt. or rear wherever works best/easiest. Don’t think a 10W blinker conversion is too common. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/28/04 at 18:12:44 Well, after many headaches and the wife yelling at me for spending to much time in the garage I finally got them working perfectly. ;D Here is how it works.... Just hook the front signals up the same way the stock lights were wired in. (If you are using single filiment lights just tape off the running light power wire.) The rear lights are were you can hook up the resistors and hide them under the seat. The best results came from hooking two 25 watt resistors inline (hook one resistor to the other) then hook the end of one resistor to the positive feed and the other to the negative (ground) feed. (As a side note some how when I hooked up the right side light I missed hooking the ground wire from the bike up to the light but since the casing for lights I bought act as the ground this is no big deal) Solder all the connections and use some liquid electrical tape and your almost done. The last step is to hide the resistors and put your seat back on. I haven't been able to take it for a test drive yet b/c in during the experimentation stages my dad was helping me since I was so stumped and he took my headlight off to conserve the battery drain. Since I had bought a new custom headlight to put on too I figured what the hell and just started getting that ready to hook up...With the exception of having to drill a new mounting hole this should be an easy one. Ha ha... As soon as I'm done with the headlight I'll post a picture for everyone to see these wonderfull new lights. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Greg_650 on 08/29/04 at 03:17:59 Well, sometimes you have to "go around your butt to scratch your elbow", but I'm glad it worked. So essentially you added 50 watts of resistance to each light, right? |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Mr 650 on 08/29/04 at 07:24:13 Quote:
Cool ! glad you have it working again. ;) Like my circuits 1 instructor once said, the mechanical boys get to use fairly exacts parts, 'we get to use parts w/ 10% or 20% varience like resistors and such. Imagine what your house would look like if the studs were allowed to be cut +,- 20 %'? Curious about this, 25 W tells us what current they can handle but not what resistance was used. Sounds like you have two small resistors in series that maybe 5 or 6 ohms. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/30/04 at 05:25:16 I found that using 2 20 watt resistors in parallel would also do the trick but when I hooked up the 25 watt resistors in parallel the same way they caused the lights to flash extremely fast. But by putting the bigger ones in line it actually caused the lights to flash slower than they did with the 20 watt ones that were parallel. During this process I tried using a 20 watt and 10 watt resistor also but then the lights didn't blink at all and they got very very hot very fast. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Mr 650 on 08/31/04 at 08:46:51 It's important to know the resistance of these. Resistance is in ohms designated w/ the little Omega symbol or there are color bars that designate the digits. Seems like brown ="1", black = "0" and the 3rd color band is the multiplier. What do they look like? If you draw too much current then you may blow the relay.BE CAREFUL |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 08/31/04 at 14:05:48 They are solid white. About 3" long |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Greg_650 on 08/31/04 at 14:23:08 Munson_kl279 wrote:
Them puppies are meant for heat, not a circuit board :o |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Mr 650 on 08/31/04 at 21:30:02 Munson_kl279 wrote:
Dude, "watts' are one thing, "ohms are another. (They are related) Are you using the prescribed resistance? ??? A 6 ohm 1/4 watt resistor is a small round cylinder you see on circuit boards, however a 6 ohm 25 watt resistor will still be 6 ohms, it just won't burn up in a high current application. If you can't find or measure the resistance ask someone who can. You may find yourself walking home one night. Otherwise, Good Luck. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 09/01/04 at 05:20:48 Mr 650 wrote:
That's why I wired in a blade fuse on both sides. |
|
Title: Re: Changing Turnsignals Post by Munson_kl279 on 09/02/04 at 06:42:57 If anyone is interested in the trouble making lights here is a link to my website: http://www.geocities.com/munsonscycle/Savage.html |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |